If you buy a bike with a Bosch motor, who owns the motor?

[DanInStPete]

I recently had to replace my Bosch Performance Line CX at 1,400 miles. Supposedly, I got it too wet. Fine, it's out of warranty. It was around $875 for the motor, $1244 installed, including tax. I went to pick up the bike, took it for a quick test ride, and then went to pay. As I was paying I asked "do you have my old motor?" The bike shop informed me that it was sitting right there in a box, that they had to send it back to Bosch, and that they were waiting for a shipping label.

Wait. What??? That's my motor, from my bike. Bosch didn't warranty it. I bought a new one. So now I own two motors, right? One old expensive broken one, one new expensive working one.

The bike shop told me, that Bosch told them, that if they didn't send MY motor back to them, they would lose their dealership (or whatever the classification is).

I gotta tell ya that this pissed me off. So, who owns the motor?

 

[fooferdoggie]

I had a motor replaced because it rusted out after 14k miles riding in the rain too much and it staying wet for days. but Bosch replaced It out of warranty and I never saw the old one. but I wonder if it is the mechanic. I can ask mine who had upgraded a few motors and see what he says. I was going to upgrade the motor on our tandem but then realized it would not lock out cranks together. makes me wonder f I would have gotten the motor back? maybe e it is just because it was damaged?

 

[DanInStPete]

I had a motor replaced because it rusted out after 14k miles riding in the rain too much and it staying wet for days. but Bosch replaced It out of warranty and I never saw the old one. but I wonder if it is the mechanic. I can ask mine who had upgraded a few motors and see what he says. I was going to upgrade the motor on our tandem but then realized it would not lock out cranks together. makes me wonder f I would have gotten the motor back? maybe e it is just because it was damaged?

Interesting they warrantied yours at 14K miles but not mine at 1400. I had thought they might. If they had, I certainly wouldn't have a problem giving them my old motor. But whether it's damaged or not I think is immaterial. My position is that it is my motor, bought an paid for. Not like I signed a licensing agreement.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I guess you could argue that if you want to keep your Bosch dealership I'll sell you the old motor for a few $$$... But then they might argue that the cost of the new motor was $875 with trade in. A small detail that's hard to argue after the fact.
I guess it's par for the course when dealing with the Reich.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

It's not uncommon for a lot of parts to be sold on an "exchange" basis. This is usually optional. You can buy a new part outright for a higher price and keep your old one if you want. It's normally discussed up front. "Do you want new, or an exchange?" I don't know if this is the case in your situation. If it is, it's quite possible the shop got sloppy and didn't discuss it with you. They may have thought why would anyone want to keep a burned out motor and given you the lower exchange price without asking you if that's what you wanted.

It all depends, but a lot of exchange parts are rebuilt, not new. (Rebuilt parts are usually guaranteed as if they were new and will typically look new.)

Now, there's room for shenanigans here. They could have charged you the new price and they are going to keep the difference. Might be worth asking about. But really, why would you want a burned out motor anyway?

TT

 

[fooferdoggie]

Interesting they warrantied yours at 14K miles but not mine at 1400. I had thought they might. If they had, I certainly wouldn't have a problem giving them my old motor. But whether it's damaged or not I think is immaterial. My position is that it is my motor, bought an paid for. Not like I signed a licensing agreement.

I think because it was just riding in the rain that rusted it out. 2 months after warranty. but I think it is the mechanic that helps too and how had they push or the rep you get.

 

[fooferdoggie]

It's not uncommon for a lot of parts to be sold on an "exchange" basis. This is usually optional. You can buy a new part outright for a higher price and keep your old one, and the d you want. It's normally discussed up front. "Do you want new, or an exchange?" I don't know if this is the case in your situation. If it is, it's quite possible the shop got sloppy and didn't discuss it with you. They may have thought why would anyone want to keep a burned out motor and given you the lower exchange price without asking you if that's what you wanted.

It all depends, but a lot of exchange parts are rebuilt, not new. (Rebuilt parts are usually guaranteed as if they were new and will typically look new.)

Now, there's room for shenanigans here. They could have charged you the new price and they are going to keep the difference. Might be worth asking about. But really, why would you want a burned out motor anyway?

TT

no thats the new price of a motor and Bosch always replaces motors with new no refurbs.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

no thats the new price of a motor and Bosch always replaces motors with new no refurbs.

If you know all that, do you know if they normally require the return of the old motor as part of the deal? I can well believe they don't sell refurbs, especially on the sly, but that makes it harder to understand why they'd require the return of the old motor.

TT

 

[DanInStPete]

It's not uncommon for a lot of parts to be sold on an "exchange" basis. This is usually optional. You can buy a new part outright for a higher price and keep your old one if you want. It's normally discussed up front. "Do you want new, or an exchange?" I don't know if this is the case in your situation. If it is, it's quite possible the shop got sloppy and didn't discuss it with you. They may have thought why would anyone want to keep a burned out motor and given you the lower exchange price without asking you if that's what you wanted.

It all depends, but a lot of exchange parts are rebuilt, not new. (Rebuilt parts are usually guaranteed as if they were new and will typically look new.)

Now, there's room for shenanigans here. They could have charged you the new price and they are going to keep the difference. Might be worth asking about. But really, why would you want a burned out motor anyway?

TT

Well, perhaps I bash my case on a rock, then I have a spare. Or because the internals are perfect I can use them later. My point is that I owned that motor and never agreed to give it back. Unless of course they wanted to replace it under warranty, then I certainly would have.

 

[fooferdoggie]

If you know all that, do you know if they normally require the return of the old motor as part of the deal? I can well believe they don't sell refurbs, especially on the sly, but that makes it harder to understand why they'd require the return of the old motor.

TT

no but I plan to ask my mechanic about it next time I see him. he had done a couple of motor upgrades too so I will ask.

 

[fooferdoggie]

Well, perhaps I bash my case on a rock, then I have a spare. Or because the internals are perfect I can use them later. My point is that I owned that motor and never agreed to give it back. Unless of course they wanted to replace it under warranty, then I certainly would have.

yes though if you Havel looked at someone refurbishing a Bosch motor it is crazy complicated. maybe they don't want them out in the wind getting fixed. but them motors have unique id's so its not like you can claim it is under warranty. who knows?

 

[Johnny]

I recently had to replace my Bosch Performance Line CX at 1,400 miles. Supposedly, I got it too wet. Fine, it's out of warranty. It was around $875 for the motor, $1244 installed, including tax. I went to pick up the bike, took it for a quick test ride, and then went to pay. As I was paying I asked "do you have my old motor?" The bike shop informed me that it was sitting right there in a box, that they had to send it back to Bosch, and that they were waiting for a shipping label.

Wait. What??? That's my motor, from my bike. Bosch didn't warranty it. I bought a new one. So now I own two motors, right? One old expensive broken one, one new expensive working one.

The bike shop told me, that Bosch told them, that if they didn't send MY motor back to them, they would lose their dealership (or whatever the classification is).

I gotta tell ya that this pissed me off. So, who owns the motor?

That sounds complete BS.

You can purchase a new Bosch motor from an online retailer for that price(~850$) and none of them is an exchange or will ask for an old broken motor to be shipped back.
On top that shop charged you ~$400 for labor.

Make sure that you keep your old motor.

 

[rpr]

This is not right. Your shop should not have agreed to this. Someone at Bosch who typically handles warranty repairs did not have the presence of mind to realize that they have no right to the motor because they refused to replace it under warranty, and your shop did not have the presence of mind to object to this irrational request from Bosch to return it to them.

 

[rpr]

Yes, complete BS.

 

[BlackHand]

Well, perhaps I bash my case on a rock, then I have a spare. Or because the internals are perfect I can use them later. My point is that I owned that motor and never agreed to give it back. Unless of course they wanted to replace it under warranty, then I certainly would have.

My understanding based on previous posts here and elsewhere is that Bosch only sells replacement motors to dealers after dealer submits the old drive unit serial number and the dealer is obligated to return or destroy the DU as a condition of sale.

It sucks, and the dealer shouldn't have assumed you wouldn't care. I would ask them to at least pull all the bearings for you (assuming it was an electrical problem due to water ingress) at no charge. Or if they really didn't have anything in writing on your work order then offer to 'sell' it to them for $500.

 

[AHicks]

My bet would be the shop is responsible for this. If they are incapable of doing the repair themselves, they can have your core sent out and repaired on the cheap and have a rebuilt motor sitting on the shelf for the next guy.

I absolutely hate being forced to deal with a dealer for ANYTHING....

 

[DanInStPete]

My understanding based on previous posts here and elsewhere is that Bosch only sells replacement motors to dealers after dealer submits the old drive unit serial number and the dealer is obligated to return or destroy the DU as a condition of sale.

I suspect this is the case, at least from what the shop told me. But is it legal? I gave no permission for the shop to return (steal?) my property.

 

[DanInStPete]

that shop charged you ~$400 for labor.

Labor $282, motor $881, tax $81.41.
Total $1244.41 to replace Bosch Performance Line CX.

 

[sc00ter]

Maybe on subject? When I was younger I worked for a lawn care company run by a coke head. Owner purchased these walk behind Honda mowers and they had "oil alert" written in big letters on the motor. Basically an alarm will sound if the oil drops to low. So we unload one at a apartment complex and the motor locks up. I drop it off at the dealer and they say it had no oil in it. The lawn company owner charges each of us 3 on the truck $750 for a new motor, because we didn't check the oil. He was going to take the money in installments from our checks. Whatever. So I go and pick the mower up from the shop a few weeks later. I know everyone at he shop pretty well. I tell them about the coke head charging us for the motor and the shop owner goes 'It was covered under warranty. The oil alert wasn't connected properly.' He gave me a copy of the warranty claim and off I go. I ask the lawn company owner about being charged and show him the paperwork. He acts all surprised and tells me not to tell the other 2 guys from the truck, or anyone else. I got up, went outside and showed everyone what crap the coke head pulled. ALL 12 of us walked off. Coke head junkie can run the mowers himself. I think 4 people went crawling back. Sorry so long.....

So maybe reach out to Bosch and ask them about this hidden policy? If they wanted the motor back it should show as a core charge on the paperwork.

 

[fooferdoggie]

It sucks, and the dealer shouldn't have assumed you wouldn't care. I would ask them to at least pull all the bearings for you (assuming it was an electrical problem due to water ingress) at no charge. Or if they really didn't have anything in writing on your work order then offer to 'sell' it to them for $500.

You can't really get the drive apart without specialized tools and the bearings more so. anytime there is a problem inside the motor warranty or not the whole unit is replaced. I have seen a few videos of a company that does it but it's pretty complex.