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  1. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    You need to keep in mind that the NHTSA did not want to release regulatory purview if a Low Speed Electric Bicycle could go faster than 20mph. This was a motor only limit. Dr. Currie knew that a 750W motor rating was NOT actually a drive system power limit but he understood power needed to be...
  2. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    Consider that Dr. Currie was a highly paid CEO of two large companies and had enough money to donate $25 million to USC. It was like he had a late life epiphany to do something a bit different (Larry Pizzi said that Dr. Currie was very excited about the future potential of ebikes ... I think he...
  3. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    So removing the requirement for blinkers, break lights, speedometer, etc. from a low speed electric bicycle was only intended to benefit his company? That is simply wrong. That simplification and pulling the legal purview from the NHTSA provided the regulatory foundation that has helped the...
  4. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    Dr. Currie was hoping to promote and sell a "LSEB" but his lobby efforts were to get the purview of LSEBs away from the NHTSA to the CPSC. After years he was successful but the NHTSA did not want "motor alone" speeds above 20mph so Currie wrote the definition in a creative way such that the...
  5. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    This is the best way to look at this. An LSEB is a bike and local officials are tasked with making decisions where they can be used but they are not tasked with sub dividing what is a compliant LSEB (or in reality an ebike is). They own USE which is where, when, age, registrations, etc. but not...
  6. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    I had a conference call with the CPSC and they avoid stepping into this debate by saying that an "LSEB" as defined by HR727 is not the same as what the states are defining as an ebike or an ebike per the 1-3 classes. I have talked with the lawyer that worked with Dr. Currie for 6 years to get...
  7. K

    British Columbia, Canada: Policy designating Class 2 and 3 e-bikes as motorized vehicles goes into effect immediately

    We control motor vehicle speeds with speeds limits, not limiting the speed of the vehicle to the lowest common denominator. LEVA has proposed a one size assist limit of 50kph (around 30mph) for all ebikes which seems to me to make great sense given we need more people out of cars and most...
  8. K

    Why Class 3 is such bad legislation...

    State and local jurisdictions CAN NOT deny MTBs on the road but they can deny ALL bikes access. In other words, the feds define what the product is (in this case a bike, which a LSEB is) and if a bike is allowed on that trails or infrastructure all bikes are (road, trail, unicycle, recumbents...
  9. K

    2022 - Top 12 Bafang Ultra M620 Ebikes

    Can someone tell me if all the lower 5 gears are an underdrive ratio such that the only way to have high speeds (say 20mph) with reasonable cadence is to have a small rear chain/belt sprocket and a larger front?
  10. K

    2022 - Top 12 Bafang Ultra M620 Ebikes

    The 3x3 still can not take 1:1 full torque from the motor + rider according to the peak torque rating. A 200lb rider standing on the cranks at horizontal produces about 160Nm to add to the Ultra's 160nM so total torque exceeds all IGH torque ratings if the drive ratio is not increased for speed...
  11. K

    concerns with ebikes laws and ways to improve them

    Please read HR727 as it defines what is legal for sale as a "low speed electric bicycle" in all 50 states. How you would consider referring to federal legislation that passed one vote short of full congressional consensus (ie keep in mind these are state representatives voting on federal...
  12. K

    concerns with ebikes laws and ways to improve them

    So very few seem to understand that the federal regulation on wattage is a MOTOR RATING, not a limit. A power limit is established by the constraints of 20mph on a level surface - essentially the power is limited above 20mph to what would sustain the ebike at 20mph, on a level surface with a...
  13. K

    concerns with ebikes laws and ways to improve them

    If ebikes are to achieve their full potential for urban mobility 15mph is too slow (oil and car industry just loves to here that position because it keeps ebikes in the recreation and leisure use realm). It's interesting that you mention being perfectly happy with a 15mph speed/assist limit...
  14. K

    Are mid drives just naturally less zippy than hub motors?

    I agree with your technical information that geared hubs will be more "zippy" feeling up to say 10mph and then direct drive hubs start to hit their strides. Obviously this is not idea for mtn bikes but for urban mobility it's where riders will spend most of their riding time. I want to add that...
  15. K

    Are mid drives just naturally less zippy than hub motors?

    I've always wondered if the higher cost and maintainance of having a torque, cadense, speed, etc. sensors were known vs just a simple throttle (this still fully allows the rider to provide all the input they desire while have 100% complete control of the assist level instead of it being...
  16. K

    Are mid drives just naturally less zippy than hub motors?

    I think what you describe is a good mountain bike but for a bike to be a better transportation / urban mobility solution maybe just a throttle is a better way to go.
  17. K

    An ebike better than a mobility vehicle?

    According to federal regulations a "low speed electric bicycle" is not a motorized vehicle (i.e. think of it as not even having a motor by definition). So long as riders travel at rational safe speeds on a MUP why would an ebike / LSEB be a problem?
  18. K

    Tucson, AZ, ban on ebikes riding the Loop

    I don't think anyone is arguing against rational speed bike/ebike speed limits on MUPs. What the debate is about is should ebikes have assist speed limits such that some feel that effectively ensures they never speed on a MUP. If you believe there should be an assist speed cutoff then you...
  19. K

    America Has An E-Bike Problem That Can’t Be Solved With More E-Bikes

    I'm a huge believer that ebikes will become a major transportation solution but it will a slow process and the infrastructure will like only improve with more riders. Most people still view bikes and even ebikes as recreational or leisure products. In reality the focus on Class 1 and 2 ebikes by...
  20. K

    Tucson, AZ, ban on ebikes riding the Loop

    Sadly that is exactly how "legal professional" bureaucrats make most decisions. They know study data is unlikely to support their position so they avoid studies and just wing it. This is pretty close to how People for Bikes came up with the 3 ebike classes. As if there is a difference between...
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