Future of Drivetrains, No Gears, No Chain.

[LandoftheGiants]

Those Lazyboi recumbents are great. If I ever get a big fat guts and weak legs I'll be out shopping for one.

 

[kevinmccune]

In principle, this bike is a bad idea. I spoke to the Gates engineer assigned to this project, and "Also." demoed the bike at Sea Otter.

Pre-ride, my qualms:
* decoupled drive system is inefficient
* specialized frame / design is unnecessarily complex, including the detachable seat that seems like a potential weak spot (also it includes electrical connections for tail light)
* too heavy
* this $3500 market segment is maybe not the place to be for a successful product

Post-demo, OMG, I am impressed!

This is not the bike for me for a number of reasons, but I'll say this...

The decoupled drive system is not noticeable. It very much feels like a directly-connected chain or belt driven bike.

It's a torque monster on the hills. Laguna Seca has a steeply-sloped surface street that gains about 100' of elevation over a 1000' run, and this bike quite capably handled it without ever feeling like it was struggling, all the while maintaining a very natural pedal cadence / feedback. Everywhere I rode it it just rips around and is very response, a very natural-feeling bike.

The auto-shifting on this bike is quite literally seamless. I asked a bunch of probing questions about the transmission and was told "I can't go into too much detail, it's proprietary" but was told there were two motors that acted in combination as a variable gearbox. I can't find any reference to this online so am not 100% confident they weren't misleading me (perhaps the pedal input is somehow considered the 2nd motor). But wow... I could not lug the motor, it didn't feel slushy or draggy, and it was super quiet under all conditions.

In fact, I tried the "manual shifting" mode and it kind of sucked, it felt like adjusting power levels and not in any way a simulated gear shift. Shifting to a higher gear only made the bike go faster without the expected loading up of the cranks.

Although I mainly rode this bike as pedal assist, it also has a thumb throttle, and that was a hoot. This is supposed to be a Class 3 ebike (28 MPH), but the thumb throttle also took it to 28 MPH, but these demos were all pre-production so I assume they are going to reduce this in production software. Not quite sure how they'll resolve this since Class 2 (thumb throttle) should be limited to 20 MPH all around.

Despite slick tires, it rode fine on the dirt. The rear wheel wouldn't spin out but I don't know if there is an anti-slip algorithm comparing rear wheel spin to the front, or if "just didn't" (it certainly has the toque to and can wheelie). The front anti-lock brake would not lock up no matter how hard I tried, even on steeply descending loose, loamy downhills. However, once stopped on those steep downhills, releasing the brake the 80 pound weight of the bike became instantly evident.

At the demo tent, there was no suspension adjustment, they just handed me an my son our bikes (I'm 200, he's 140). I can't speak for him, but my suspension felt very natural kind of like I'd expect an all-mountain setup, in other words not XC harsh and not DH pillowy.

The 80 pound bike weight means this bike cannot be easily transported without a proper rack and/or loading ramp. It would also be not very fun to take up even a short flight of stairs.

The three seat mast attachments Also. had on hand were the version with the attached rear cargo ramp, one with a traditional saddle and an adjustable-height seatpost, and another with more of a mid-length banana seat without adjustable height.

I would absolutely LOVE to have one of these bikes in my garage but alas it wouldn't really be practical for me, particularly from the standpoint of bicycle home maintenance. Speaking of maintenance, these are going to be direct sales, but Also. is working with local shops to act as their service centers.

I hope this bike can find an audience and some success, because it's really good (and fun!). But I'm pessimistic just knowing how tough this market is.

if its made correctly maintenance should not be an issue.

 

[LandoftheGiants]

Space based data centers do not have problems with power and cooling. They also do not have greasy chains.

Data Center Space Race: Can Orbital’s Satellites Overcome Doubts?

A US startup plans solar-powered AI satellites, but experts warn that technical and economic challenges may delay space-based data centers.

www.datacenterknowledge.com

Some interesting debate on the topic of cooling

Space is cold, but it’s terrible at cooling. | Kevin Novak

Space is cold, but it’s terrible at cooling. There’s a growing chorus—Pichai, Musk, Bezos, Altman—pitching AI data centers in orbit. Energy? I buy it: unfiltered solar, no real-estate tax, square footage measured in kilometers not acres. The physics they skip: getting heat out. → Vacuum means...

www.linkedin.com

 

[kevinmccune]

Some interesting debate on the topic of cooling

Space is cold, but it’s terrible at cooling. | Kevin Novak

Space is cold, but it’s terrible at cooling. There’s a growing chorus—Pichai, Musk, Bezos, Altman—pitching AI data centers in orbit. Energy? I buy it: unfiltered solar, no real-estate tax, square footage measured in kilometers not acres. The physics they skip: getting heat out. → Vacuum means...

www.linkedin.com

if you don't have a cold mass,then radiation is your only option!( convection surely wont work in a vacuum!)

 

[PedalUma]

if you don't have a cold mass,then radiation is your only option!( convection surely wont work in a vacuum!)

True, but infrared will radiate into deep space directly. That is why it gets so cold by dawn in a cloudless desert like the Sahara. A friend said China is making under sea data centers. It costs nothing to cool them and they can still be near shore. If they were really smart tides and currents would power them.

 

[scrambler]

True, but infrared will radiate into deep space directly. That is why it gets so cold by dawn in a cloudless desert like the Sahara. A friend said China is making under sea data centers. It costs nothing to cool them and they can still be near shore. If they were really smart tides and currents would power them.

Under the sea is very different as you have water to conduct the heat.
The problem in space is that there is nothing to conduct heat, which makes it very poor for cooling.

 

[PCeBiker]

Heat can be dissipated in deep space, if the proper frequency can be utilized.

Just beam it off into oblivion

 

[kevinmccune]

True, but infrared will radiate into deep space directly. That is why it gets so cold by dawn in a cloudless desert like the Sahara. A friend said China is making under sea data centers. It costs nothing to cool them and they can still be near shore. If they were really smart tides and currents would power them.

like Irelands,generation? what kind of an ecosystem would develop around warming nutrient rich waters,well there are systems proposed that could operate on the temperature difference between cold ocean bottom and warmer surface waterside hope it wouldn't disrupt any vital currents, the meltoff now is said to be disrupting the "thermohaline" water circulation currents if the Gulf stream collapses Europe is going to freeze. Btw you can build a cooling appliance that is aimed at a cold spot in the sky and there are actually paints so reflective now,they will cool a roof below ambient( get this one version uses calcium carbonate( no need for TiO apparently) there is so much we could do if the plutocrats and oligarchs would allow it,we do not want another "French revolution" just to be treated fairly.

 

[kevinmccune]

Under the sea is very different as you have water to conduct the heat.
The problem in space is that there is nothing to conduct heat, which makes it very poor for cooling.

unless you can latch into a mass that would absorb and reradiated heat quicker then its produced( that's what entropy is all about anyway?) or concentrate and utilize for electric production or industrail usage.

 

[kevinmccune]

Tides and eddie currents have powered humanity since forever.
The girls bleed in sink with the tides at every full moon

no I told mine never to bleed in sink,use shower and water closet( oh you meany sync,sorry I misunderstood)

 

[PedalUma]

Under the sea is very different as you have water to conduct the heat.
The problem in space is that there is nothing to conduct heat, which makes it very poor for cooling.

True, conduction does not work without a conductor. The electromagnetic spectrum works fine in space, that is how we see the stars and communicate with satalites. Infrared is part of the light spectrum. The heat gets sent out into cold black deep space.

 

[PCeBiker]

True, conduction does not work without a conductor.

And yet the sun conducts it's energy to earth every day through the vacuum of space

 

[PedalUma]

And yet the sun conducts it's energy to earth every day through the vacuum of space

It transmits its heat and light without conducting anything. Your wireless IR TV remote does not conduct, it transmits.

 

[scrambler]

And yet the sun conducts it's energy to earth every day through the vacuum of space

No, it radiates, with a Radiation intensity of colossal proportion

 

[PedalUma]

When looking for how light was 'conducted', it is how we found out about the big bang. The residual background from the big bang was in every direction. And we realized that there is no conductor in space.

 

[PCeBiker]

No, it radiates, with a Radiation intensity of colossal proportion

We need a drive train of colossal proportions
I want to radiate Power

We need to Fight Back against the Sun !!

And the Father

And that ambiguous Holy Ghost

 

[scrambler]

Heat can transfer by 3 means

1. Conduction (contact with a material)
2. Convection (fluid movement)
3. Radiation (electromagnetic waves)

 

[PedalUma]

Heat can transfer by 3 means
Conduction (contact)
Convection (fluid movement)
Radiation (electromagnetic waves)

And spicy BBQ is a great way to make some heat. Tall natural redheads doing yoga poses with sheer tops also transmit heat.
Off topic: A friend recorded a football match this morning while out. We both avoided any news and watched it after spicy BBQ tonight. It was the best game ever. Egypt Vs. Argentina. The underdog Egypt was up 3-0 then got a point removed after a replay of an encounter minutes before far on the other side of the field that had nothing to do with the goal and was not called at the time. 2-0. Then Argentina went off-sides to make a goal with no penalty. 2-1. Messi made a goal. 2-2. Then Argentina made one more goal. Argentina won 3-2 in the final seconds. Egypt was the better team.

 

[scrambler]

Photons are particals with mass that transmit through a vacuum

Actually light can be both particle and electromagnetic wave.
This is quite a complex area of physics

 

[LandoftheGiants]

Radiation naturally implies large 'radiators'. The International Space Station manages heat using internal water loops, external ammonia loops, and massive exterior radiators. And when pumps fail they have to be replaced. Also when electronic memory fails, it needs replacing too. What's the cost to lift one ton into near earth orbit? 3 million on modern reusable rockets, $10 million to $25 million per ton using a dedicated small rocket or legacy system. Of course that 3 million tag is for a major lift, a small "fix it" lift would be an order of magnitude higher. Now why go to all that expense when you can simply build them on earth beside a river? Where dedicated staff are on hand to resolve problems. The whole space data center thing is just more Elon Hype I'd say, designed to keep the share price high. Like the rehashed Mars base concept.